The Soapbox

Joined: 01/04/2001 Posts: 27052
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I fundamentally disagree with that logic. There are two different

questions here. The idea that there is a "crisis" at the southern border is nonsensical, and the fact that repubs could not unite behind a wall when they held both houses of congress is exhibit A of that. I strongly oppose a declaration of emergency to bypass Congress.

But that's a sunk cost in financial terms. We are where we are. People are feeling real pain now, today. I tend to agree with you that Trump is the greater reason for the shutdown. But if the dems have it in their power to end it (and even if they gave in to Trump on his 5.7 bil, we're not getting a wall across the whole border for that), and they don't, well, they share in the blame.

If an asshole standing next to me heartlessly flings a two year old into 5 feet of water and laughs as the kid drowns, the asshole is guilty of murder. But if I do nothing when all I have to do is reach out and pick the kid up, I share in the responsibility. And I'm a massive douche even if you only want to pin 20% of the blame on me, with no legal jeopardy at all for the murder.

There is only upside in offering a deal. On so many levels.

(In response to this post by WaxHoo)

Posted: 01/14/2019 at 1:32PM

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Current Thread:

Trump chief economic adviser: Furloughed workers are ‘better off’ (link) -- Hoo TV 01/14/2019 06:41AM

One gov't worker rationing insulin for her diabetes b/c she can't afford it -- WahooMatt05 01/14/2019 08:45AM

Can you link stories to all killed/raped/robbed/assualted by illegals? ** -- LAHOOters 01/14/2019 2:02PM

Or their deep concern for unemployed coal miners not affording insulin. ** -- Hoodafan 01/14/2019 2:18PM

We should be providing them job training to do something else ** -- WahooMatt05 01/14/2019 2:38PM

Insulin prices have been steadily rising, too (link) -- Hoo TV 01/14/2019 10:51AM

The fact that generic insulin isn't dirt cheap and easy to get is criminal ** -- WahooMatt05 01/14/2019 11:12AM

Why don't doctors just prescribe the old, non-patented stuff if -- BocaHoo91 01/14/2019 12:21PM

Is it available? Drug makers make what is profitable; not what is "best" -- Quaker 01/14/2019 12:32PM

I don't know... but generics make money by profitably selling off-patent -- BocaHoo91 01/14/2019 12:39PM

Here's one take... -- BocaHoo91 01/14/2019 12:42PM

Wasn't this a House episode? ** -- Faz d. Hoo 01/14/2019 1:17PM

Ha, I had the same thought. -- WahooMatt05 01/14/2019 1:34PM

There are no generics for insulin. That seems insane -- WahooMatt05 01/14/2019 12:31PM

Especially after the 3 researchers who discovered it sold the patent to the -- Hoo TV 01/14/2019 11:23AM

That sounds fabricated. ** -- MasterRusty 01/14/2019 09:22AM

Why? ** -- hoolstoptheheels 01/14/2019 09:24AM

TBF, I often look at these sob stories -- BocaHoo91 01/14/2019 10:14AM

Honsetly Boca you can look at it any way you want. The bigger issue is -- hoolstoptheheels 01/14/2019 11:27AM

No, the bigger issue is that the "party of science" backpedals to -- Faz d. Hoo 01/14/2019 11:43AM

Ummm, ok. I find it hard to imagine that you would ever see a time in -- hoolstoptheheels 01/14/2019 12:18PM

Party of science, unless it pertains to gender or a fetus. -- Hoodafan 01/14/2019 12:38PM

Speaking of lazy and disingenuous..... ** -- WahooRQ 01/14/2019 4:30PM

Okay can you explain what you mean by "gender and fetus" in relation -- 111Balz 01/14/2019 1:10PM

No, that's not accurate. -- hoolstoptheheels 01/14/2019 1:07PM

That fetus, if uninterrupted by abortion, will go on to become a meaningful -- Hoodafan 01/14/2019 1:25PM

And one might be pro-transgender rights, and pro-choice and have a sound -- 111Balz 01/14/2019 3:28PM

Ok, I'm fine with not calling repubs "science deniers" -- hoolstoptheheels 01/14/2019 1:45PM

Yeah, like I said, didn't mean to go off on a tangent. -- Hoodafan 01/14/2019 1:56PM

It's an inconvenient truth. Government workers who survive paycheck -- 111Balz 01/14/2019 09:36AM

I do have a bone to pick with the dems on this though. If dems are so -- hoolstoptheheels 01/14/2019 09:49AM

The lobbyist financed trip to Puerto Rico on a chartered jet for 30 Dem -- Tuckahokie 01/14/2019 10:14AM

... to those looking for outrage in all the wrong places ** -- 111Balz 01/14/2019 10:16AM

IOKIADDI ** -- HokieDan95 01/14/2019 11:48AM

Nice thing about the chartered jet...very little interaction with the TSA ** -- Tuckahokie 01/14/2019 10:18AM

They don't want to give trump any victory to campaign on for 2020 ** -- HokieDan95 01/14/2019 10:04AM

This -- Capital City Hoo 01/14/2019 10:01AM

Never negotiate with hostage takers. ** -- WaxHoo 01/14/2019 10:00AM

Yay! Go non-hostage takers team! ** -- Hoodafan 01/14/2019 10:44AM

Bad analogy IMHO Wax. We should always be negotiating across the -- hoolstoptheheels 01/14/2019 10:07AM

Negotiation requires good faith on both sides. Trump isn't negotiating. -- WaxHoo 01/14/2019 10:16AM

Certainly no less than the dems. And negotiating does not require good -- hoolstoptheheels 01/14/2019 11:17AM

The Dems didn't come up with the wall, didn't say MX would pay for it. -- WaxHoo 01/14/2019 12:00PM

And if furloughed employees die because they can't take their -- hoolstoptheheels 01/14/2019 12:25PM

You do realize the GOP could have taken care of this anytime during the -- WaxHoo 01/14/2019 12:52PM

I fundamentally disagree with that logic. There are two different -- hoolstoptheheels 01/14/2019 1:32PM

Do your job Nancy! That's what I don't get from her and Chuck's stance. -- Hoodafan 01/14/2019 1:42PM

Problem is, who defines what her job is? Or what Trump's job is? -- hoolstoptheheels 01/14/2019 2:00PM

I do of course! :-) Their job is to overcome differences and get something -- Hoodafan 01/14/2019 2:07PM

I happen to agree with you. I think the dem calc is intransigence serves -- hoolstoptheheels 01/14/2019 2:12PM

Only Trumpist ignoramuses will think NanChuck favor illegal immigration -- WaxHoo 01/14/2019 1:46PM

Walls work. Why are they physics deniers? :-) ** -- Hoodafan 01/14/2019 1:59PM

O yea. The Great Wall. Hadrian's Wall, the Walls of Jerico, etc -- WaxHoo 01/14/2019 2:04PM

Dammit, hsth -- WaxHoo 01/14/2019 1:41PM

Just trying to make my point. There are many on the dem side -- hoolstoptheheels 01/14/2019 1:54PM

Which Dems would Schumer deliver to put them over 60 to get a vote? The -- Hoodafan 01/14/2019 1:06PM

LOL ** -- WaxHoo 01/14/2019 1:08PM

Welcome back you angry SOB! ** -- Hoodafan 01/14/2019 1:26PM

Thanks. Great to be here. Hooda. ** -- WaxHoo 01/14/2019 1:29PM

Nah. Hit the hoops board. Better for your anger issues. :-) -- Hoodafan 01/14/2019 1:32PM

St Maarten. The best Carib island imo. Check it out -- WaxHoo 01/14/2019 1:36PM

Why the best if you don't mind my asking? And isn't it a little harder, -- Hoodafan 01/14/2019 1:50PM

My answer will depend upon when you are thinking about going. -- WaxHoo 01/14/2019 2:07PM

Schedule will be dependent on when the witnesses can all coordinate their -- Hoodafan 01/14/2019 2:15PM

OK, here's astart: -- WaxHoo 01/14/2019 2:43PM

Thanks! -- Hoodafan 01/14/2019 2:53PM

The normal sniping aside, congratulations, Hooda! ** -- WahooRQ 01/14/2019 5:21PM

You getting married (sorry, was really slow on the uptake there) Congrats! -- WaxHoo 01/14/2019 3:02PM

Is Trump even trying to negotiate with Mexico? ** -- Shenhoo 01/14/2019 12:06PM

Mexico is being every bit as intransigent as the Dims (pic) -- Hoo TV 01/14/2019 12:14PM

Required viewing for everyone in this thread ** -- WaxHoo 01/14/2019 12:58PM

He should shut down the MX gov't until they pony up. ** -- WaxHoo 01/14/2019 12:08PM

LOL! ** -- Hoodafan 01/14/2019 10:45AM

The same reason why you don't give in... -- Hoodeac 01/14/2019 09:58AM

I might give in to the two year old in some form or fashion.. -- hoolstoptheheels 01/14/2019 10:05AM

Oh I don't disagree with you. I keep hoping trump will declare the -- 111Balz 01/14/2019 09:57AM

They should call their relatives who received those one time $500-$1000 -- hooshouse 01/14/2019 08:22AM

Probably already sank it into kitchen renovations, a new car, or a family -- Hoo TV 01/14/2019 08:37AM

New iphone, because the one they already had is already 1 year out of date. -- JSHoo 01/14/2019 11:18AM

At least you can actually buy an iPhone for $1000 ** -- Hoo TV 01/14/2019 11:26AM

A friend in the FAA who is doing well, and actually enjoying -- HoosWillWin 01/14/2019 08:05AM

Yeah, I'd be okay indefinitely, too, even if I wouldn't even get back pay, -- Hoo TV 01/14/2019 08:12AM

Really stresses the importance of building an emergency cash -- BocaHoo91 01/14/2019 08:51AM

I realize that this would likely take longer than ending the shutdown to -- Tuckahokie 01/14/2019 09:00AM

Why? in the end, they will have the -- VaTechie 01/14/2019 11:26AM

Who's granting those waivers? The IRS is part of the partial shutdown. ** -- hoolstoptheheels 01/14/2019 09:23AM

I am not sure who would have to approve...but like I said, very unlikely in -- Tuckahokie 01/14/2019 09:26AM

I personally would not support it anyway. -- hoolstoptheheels 01/14/2019 09:57AM

The cynical side of me has observed people putting more priority -- HoosWillWin 01/14/2019 08:55AM

That certainly is the case for a segment of -- BocaHoo91 01/14/2019 09:17AM

Devil's advocate -- WahooMatt05 01/14/2019 09:26AM

No argument that Jan can typically be a -- BocaHoo91 01/14/2019 09:39AM

A surprisingly high percentage of people are just a few paychecks away from -- Tuckahokie 01/14/2019 09:31AM

It's not just keeping up with the Joneses -- WahooMatt05 01/14/2019 09:49AM

Throw in the cost of childcare -- Hoojack 01/14/2019 10:45AM

No kidding. Got a -- Shenhoo 01/14/2019 12:09PM

Just go with one family income. Problem solved. ** -- WahooMatt05 01/14/2019 11:10AM

One advantage of the furlough...less childcare expense (I kid...I kid) ** -- Tuckahokie 01/14/2019 10:49AM

I know you’re joking but -- Hoojack 01/14/2019 10:51AM

IMO, you should prioritize your 6 months emergency fund ahead of 401K, and -- BocaHoo91 01/14/2019 10:40AM

And of course what % of people have no retirement fund because -- 111Balz 01/14/2019 09:59AM

Every dime to "survive"? -- BocaHoo91 01/14/2019 10:41AM

So I thought the sub discussion had gone beyond just Fed government -- 111Balz 01/14/2019 10:59AM

I would guess that roughly 20% of the population has -- BocaHoo91 01/14/2019 12:02PM

That poverty line number has barely moved in 50 years...not sure what the -- Tuckahokie 01/14/2019 11:03AM

Or even one paycheck ** -- 111Balz 01/14/2019 09:39AM

Some people in this world are shockingly out of touch and tone deaf -- BocaHoo91 01/14/2019 07:23AM